display: none !important; I found it surprising while doing AAS research there is little to NO data on return of HPTA function after stopping AAS of any type. When too much estrogen interacts with the estrogen receptors of the hypothalamus, there is a negative feed-back loop that tells the gland that there must be too much testosterone as well. My doc originally took me from about 180ng/ml to 700 and maintained me at that level. She has me scheduled for a brain MRI to make sure i have no underling causes, after . Training was an integral part of my life and who I am for so long and I'm so much better off being back at it. Post-cycle AAS therapy, in most cases, includes something to decrease estrogen levels and activity, and some other drug to replace LH. In Depth Testosterone Cypionate Profile! It is important for the HCG administration to have been completed with 6 or 7 clear days before the onset of PCT in order to avoid inhibition of the Nolvadex and/or Clomid therapy. 2003 Feb;68(2):370-4. On the other hand tongkat continues to raise the bar higher and higher in time as you continue using tongkat. Normal total testosterone production for a healthy male is about 500-600ng/dl (too many are in the 200-350ng/dl range due to environmental estrogens alone), but some AAS users push the levels into the 2000-3000ng/dl plus area. You will receive a link to create a new password via email. Dan was sharp (he kept us all thinking), but he missed on this one. But 258lbs 6'2 17% bodyfat seems pretty maxed out imo. If I start tomorrow doing 500iu 2x a week (including the 2 weeks before PCT), that comes to 10500iu, leaving me 1500iu extra to play with. To turn off your PC in Windows 10, select the Start button, select the Power button, and then select Shut down. Questions for Specific Doctors & Experts . Because of the consistent sub-optimal readings I've gotten over the last few years I'm now attempting to do a restart since the last time I did one it seemed to go pretty well and . Hard to fathom. I really do not need hcg for testicular functions but properly need it for receptor saturation. It sounds like you have more than one reason why FT is low, LH on the lower end and the only way someone could have FT at the bottom of the ranges is SHBG on the higher end. In the 90's, a few viable performance-enhancing options such as creatine monohydrate and whey protein made their way into the market thus finally offering health and performance oriented alike something of statistical value. This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply. 1993 Dec;77(6):1529-34. Put it this way, I was at my genetic limit before starting my cycle and then going into TRT. HCG sees use in some PCT but that is a misconception because HCG works quickly and restores testicular volume giving the appearance of treatment however in the long run does not properly restart your HPTA. This is simply not true for the majority of the cases. An integral part of the limbic system, the hypothalamus is involved in regulation of the internal milieu of the body or, said another way, for homeostatic control. We respect your privacy and take protecting it seriously, Captcha:* * This is the proper protocol for a successful normalization, this is the program that allows for you to transpose from exogenous testosterone replacement therapy to be all natural WITHOUT testosterone deficiency and the living hell many endure without being able to restore your own levels. (7)(8), SERMs: These medications will attach to various estrogen receptors and interfere with the hypothalamus testosterone recognition leading to an increase LH/FSH. By most accounts, nandrolone is an extremely mild steroid. This is how homeostasis is maintained in the human body. Welcome to ExcelMale.com, the leading and best-moderated mens health forum focused on increasing health, potency and productivity in men. Steroid users typically use the androgens in a cycle of six to 18 weeks, often followed by a break in which they may use unproven therapies such as tamoxifen, clomiphene citrate and/or hCG in an attempt to return their hormones to normal faster. Testosterone Replacement, Low T, HCG, & Beyond. And Things That Go Hump More In the Night, Known as the Steroid Guru, Dan Duchaine was the author of. Resko JA, Connolly PB, Roselli CE, Abdelgadir SE, Choate JV. Natural testosterone production relies on a balance of hypothalamus hormones including gonadotropin releasing hormone (GnRH), pituitary hormones including luteinizing hormone (LH), and the testicles where testosterone is produced. Their may be little you can do about the SHBG, so any testosterone gains you make will quickly be bound up to SHBG and deactivated not allowing your FT to increase enough. The Agaricus bisporus extract because the right method of extract provides some very effective site-specific aromatase enzyme inhibition, and the 7b-Hydroxy-DHEA because it is preferential physiological base compound for many good things. This is not a problem in men who are supplementing testosterone (TRT), but once the hormone is discontinued, there is nothing to replace it. . 34.245.32.234 Thus estrogen produced by a cow (which is present throughout the meat) is a xenoestrogen. I personally do not believe anything I cannot prove myself in the lab. You might stop producing natural testosterone altogether. do all ysl bags come with authenticity cards, south alabama track and field scholarship standards, parexel clinical research associate salary near berlin, World Record For Most Spacebar Clicks In 1 Minute. Hmmm, look bad, feel bad and not care. Sundays - Closed, 8642 Garden Grove Blvd. Always consult a physician or qualified health professional on any matters regarding your health or on any opinions expressed within this website. This would (and has) obviously allow for optimization of human male performance. Scientific studies showed that all subjects returned to baseline in 45 days using this protocol. I was afraid that could be the case but I figured since I did run a bunch of cycles in the past with no HCG that maybe it would stimulate the testes to a higher point as a last ditch effort. Which test ester is best for not getting high rbc and henorit? Note: If devices connected to your PC (like monitors, printers, or scanners) aren't working properly after waking up from sleep or hibernate, you might need to disconnect and reconnect your device . Typically, if your HPTA is shutdown, that means your body's natural production of testosterone is no longer operating. Depending upon bodyweight and level of estrogens in a man's body, at 600mg daily AT appears to be reasonably useful, and in truth it was the only viable option for sometime. DHEA and Pregnenolone are converted via enzymes to testosterone and estrogen, as well as host of other metabolites which are required for other hormones of the nuclear receptor family. The most popular and probably effective is HCG while the test is metabolizing off, then clomid after that. Go off HCG, it will keep you shut down, you've been on a month, that's enough. HCG will not work well for a restart, HCG suppresses the HTPA and doesnt do anything to increase LH which is what you need and what clomid does, Im afraid using HCG to restart will be futile. Back in my 20s I ran some testosterone cycles with pct (but no hcg) for a total of about 5 years off an on but I havent touched any gear in about 6 years. Week 1-4 HCG 1,000 EoD Week 1-6 Aromasin 12.5mg/Day week 4-9 Clomid 100,100,100, 50, 50. PCT stands for Post-Cycle-Therapy and refers to HPTA regeneration or stimulation. In regard to everyone's favorite naturally occurring man-making androgen, testosterone is king of the muscle building anabolicsand your body can make WAY more than you need through HPTA Supraphysiological Overcompensation. An HPTA restart will comprise of two phases, HCG and AI use to activate the testicles to be receptive to the LH/FSH pulse when the medications are discontinued. When you stop receiving exogenous Testosterone (Testosterone from outside the body), your deficiency symptoms will likely return. Brief back story: Im 35 years old with TT readings around 400-450 and free T at the bottom range (8-10). Watermelon Breeze Tropicana, Thanks. Take precautions and aim to achieve. The increased estrogen sends signals that there is to much conversion, while your Hypothalamus sends signals that too much estrogen is in your system, so the secretion of LH and FSH is halted. Ellinwood WE, Hess DL, Roselli CE, Spies HG, Resko JA. And yes, running HCG at this point will only mimic LH production and interrupt your HPTA feedback loop the same way injecting testosterone does. Back in my 20's I ran some testosterone cycles with pct (but no hcg) for a total of about 5 years off an on but I haven't touched any gear in about 6 years. . }. This is not to say that it was not a useful compound. There is a huge misconception that we can take huge amounts of steroids and we do not have to worry about not producing testosterone because we are replacing it with an exogenous source. Last edited by a moderator: Apr 22, 2007. fit4life05 Member. In the case of HPTA-function and optimized testosterone production, it is due to 2 primary negative feed-back loops. I have a specific question that I cant seem to find the answer to so Im hoping you can help. 5 This includes the stimulation of LH production in the pituitary or stimulation of the testicular cells to produce testosterone. shut down is shut down, and restart is restart. We have protocols to assist patients in restarting their HPTA axis. 4) Combination therapy Clomiphene Citrate and HCG 5000IU. I ask this because I know a lot of guys start before they reach their genetic potential, and at that point we cannot make an accurate assessment. An HPTA restart will comprise of two phases, HCG and AI use to activate the testicles to be receptive to the LH / FSH pulse when the medications are discontinued. It works by blocking more powerful and active estrogens from merging with the hypothalamic estrogen receptors. do all ysl bags come with authenticity cards; albuquerque arabic origin; markham skating rink schedule; south alabama track and field scholarship standards; parexel clinical research associate salary near berlin; does hcg shut down hpta. Wasn't really sure how to title this but I have some questions and some assumptions Im wondering if are valid or not. = 1992 Oct;43(4):281-7.In vitro potency and selectivity of the non-steroidal androgen aromatase inhibitor CGS 16949A compared to steroidal inhibitors in the brain. JIMO - Because you are using exogenous Testosterone your HPT Axis is already suppressed so in essence your negative feed back loop in in full gear. Live. I know deca and fina shut down your HPTA hard. The second phase will comprise of medications to stimulate endogenous production of testosterone, both phases end when labs dictate they are done. fivem weapon spawn names. Mechanism of Suppression. For the sake of my eyesight I will not be running clomid or nolvadex. Most guys use hcg during a cycle to keep the testicles their normal size, other guys use it right after a cycle to get their testicle size back and to stimulate them into producing testosterone. Garden Grove, CA 92844, Contact Us! Considering TRT for Accutane related hormonal changes, My Experience with Brachytherapy for Prostate Cancer, Treatments for Low Sexual Desire in Women & Men, Struggling with Low Libido? This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. Rick Vallejo is an industry veteran. Why? My dose of T is pretty low and I do not want to lower it any more. Powered by Discourse, best viewed with JavaScript enabled. Oral DHEA supplementation increased circulating DHEA-S and free testosterone levels well above baseline in the middle-aged group, with no significant effect on total testosterone levels. It makes since that HCG will suppress LH release due to the increase Testosterone production effecting the negative feedback loop. Penile Implant For Young Patient Who Exhausted Usual Treatments. World Record For Most Spacebar Clicks In 1 Minute, Subjects were HPTA shutdown with T cyp injections, LH/FSH were close to zero in a couple of days. . Well, I would like it to be the way you say. It is this hormone that is measured by early pregnancy tests and if present, will return a positive result. As such if one eats beef, one is eating a xenoestrogen. In vitro studies have shown ATD to be a powerful androgen receptor blocker of the hypothalamusbut not of peripheral androgen receptors. There's a video showing a study where they give different amount of testosterone to each group. New magazine focusing on increasing personal fitness, physique and performance. The phase two HCG restart hopes to bring back normal testosterone levels and sensitize the leydig cells. Naturally there is a dose dependant issue here which is a supplemental oxymoron: Low bioavailability means higher dosages needed, that in turn result in greater amounts of AT being converted to the feminizing estrogens 6-keto-estrone and 6-keto-estradiol. Now I don't want to derail this into a discussion about genetic potentials because those aren't the answers I'm looking for, I'm decided on that question already and if I'm wrong the only way I'm going to realize it is by learning it first hand anyway,and like I said enjoying every minute of the ride and if the price I pay ends up being TRT, that isn't the end of the world either. 1986 Oct;25(4):593-600. Hi, Im coming off trt , after a year . Thank you both for the responses! As such we used 8 healthy males as human guinea pigs to test what the research claims to be factual. Some of the hormone and metabolic markers tested include: Patient success is measured by how they respond to treatment. Open to hearing other thoughts but if the consensus is to just stop the HCG and levels will bounce back on their own, I can do that. is my hemo and hematocrit crazy high or ??? Not to the same extent as for example 19-nors. Nolvadex, Clomid and HCG in Post Cycle Therapy By Bigfella & PartyBoy - MuscleTalk Moderators Why Bodybuilders Use Clomid Clomid is a generic name for Clomiphene Citrate and is a synthetic oestrogen. 3 Dec 4, 2022 #12 Vanargandar Member. Someone else with a medical background will need to provide a chart, etc. All steroids act similar to testosterone in the body, therefore they all shut you down. 2001 Jun;86(6):2600-6. If you experience low Testosterone, this process wont stop your low T symptoms from returning once you resume your natural production levels. Heres what you need to know about the cost of TRT at Defy Medical. 03 HOURS. Numazawa M, Tsuji M, Mutsumi A. Tohoku College of Pharmacy, Sendai, Japan. Here is my blood work. Like all things we really like in life, there is a series of checks and balances that keep things in control and limit the amounts of good stuff we can have (like girlfriends). Department of Anatomy, Mount Sinai School of Medicine, CUNY, New York 10029. Charity; FMCG; Media Kaplan ME, McGinnis MY. Are Viagra & Cialis Unfair Advantages Or Divine Blessings? Recent Yearly Bloodwork- some help please! Like LH this hormone is also sent out from the pituitary and signals the Sertoli cells inside the testicles to make sperm. This was due to the structural similarities the two compounds possessed. Ph: (714) 638 - 3640 With that being said Im one month into running HCG which I was planning on running for 8 weeks total (800 ius 3x per week) and my question is what is the best way to come off of the HCG? 1 When discontinuing a long-acting injectable ester, such as cypionate or enanthate, therapy to stop TRT is usually initiated roughly five days after the last injection, as the hormone levels start to fall. The second phase will comprise of medications to stimulate endogenous production of testosterone, both phases end when labs dictate they are done. Wondering if HCG itself will trigger the down regulation of the above hormones causing lower amounts of both. Using HCG during hormone supplementation can help the HPTA recover faster after hormones are discontinued. Press the Windows logo key + X on your keyboard, and then select Shut down or sign out > Hibernate. Do Not hating, but I wouldn't waste my time with that. Also, its possible that your testes have gone dormant, which means they need to be restarted so they can produce Testosterone again. So HERE is exactly how Testosterone supplementation (AAS) Shuts you down. JIMO. besides Fertility, is there any down stream or related consequences on someones health with a shut down HPTA for 50-60yrs? Before self medication, take heed to advise above and get BW done. When the HPTA shuts down due to mono TRT does the pituitary shut down entirely? Little Pink Pill AKA Female Viagra. In fact, the only research I am aware of is that dealing with contraception, a single oxandrolone study, and a very early study on body composition. I'm 6'2". Copyright 2012 - 2022 Evolutionary.org. Stick with clomid, Nolva and aromasin. Just wondering if HCG therapy will suppress what little LH and FSH levels a TRT patient may have. Most have realized notable HPTA recovery and/or androgen production stimulation form administering 1000iu HCG 3 times weekly for 21 days post-cycle. Department of Physiology, Oregon Health Sciences University, Portland 97201. This all depends on your initial diagnosis. Don't get me started on chemically raised meats and pesticides either. J Steroid Biochem Mol Biol. Take precaution, research thoroughly and never take a shortcut and you will keep yourself in good health and be able to make the most out of every cycle you run, promote longevity and continue to lead a long and healthy life. I am 27 years old and shutdown from prior steroid cycles and being very dumb. Amateur Bodybuilder Join Date Jan 2003 Location AZ Posts 827 You don't need to restart your testes when coming off of HCG Monotherapy obviously. Very long term TRT (20+ years) - risk of liver cancer? Also will be getting bloods 4 weeks in- if my estro is in the shitter I'll have HCG on hand to remedy. Interestingly enough, this pregnant woman's hormone is effective to a point that some studies have shown it to be able to prevent testicular dysfunction during anabolic steroid use. This is the responsibility of an enzyme called aromatase that is present pretty much everywhere in the bodyeven the brain around the hypothalamus (remember that). The reason most AAS users employ the drugs is to un-naturally increase their testosterone levels to 2-5 times what is so-called natural or normal. Thanks guys, I will properly reincorporate HCG soon. And though it does aromatize, it does so at a very slow rate. Of course some studies have shown that the correct ratio of 3-OHAT and ATD administered to adult human males results in an average increase in bioavailable testosterone of up to 400% and a direct decrease in estrogens of an average 50%. This hormone gets sent from the pituitary to the Leydig cells inside the testicles, signaling them to make testosterone. I suggest you consider changing to daily shots, same total weekly dose. 20-Dec-2011, 01:33 PM #4. the steroids that DO NOT cause SHUTDOWN of the HPTA, do NOT oversaturate ANY of . It appears I have two options which are stop cold turkey and wait for my pituitary to kick back in or possibly run arimidex (which I have on hand )and try to stimulate it that way. As the better companies employed more real scientists, they became more apt at researching and marketing substances that truly could be said to be "steroid-like" in effect. Lahore, Pakistan 0092 (42) 37304691 info@sadiqindustries.com. You can speed this up (and you should) by taking a combination of HCG, Nolvadex and Clomid. Do consult a proper endocrinologist for information. But then again Big J whos pretty big still; like 5'9 260lbs around 15-18% bodyfat or so with abs has been off for years is holding a good amount of size. Each case needs to be reviewed individually and certain individuals may have less of a chance at recovering than others. rosellic@ohsu.edu. All HCG does is trick your balls into thinking it's still producing LH, but it's not. However, with a smart dosing protocol and a sensible dosage, suppression will be very minimal and a non-issue. This action results in a decrease in total circulatory estrogen. One main concern with the "AT" structure is its potential conversion to the feminizing estrogens 6-keto-estrone and 6-keto-estradiol (Estradiol's of any kind are as much as 10 times more powerful than estrogen's). June 14, 2022; Warning: Science Geek Stuff (That Actually Matters). #4. It also has the ability make more thyroid hormones and other fat burning substances than you could ever reasonably want (never met a reasonable bodybuilder but I did hear of one once). (Xeno comes from the Greek, meaning strange or foreign.). 1984 Dec;59(6):1088-96. is my hemo and hematocrit crazy high or ??? Work to maximize human performance through health promoting physiological optimization (WADA, IOC and pro-sports friendly). [/quote]. Total testosterone and DHEA-S dropped significantly until 24 h after HIIT for both age groups, while free testosterone of DHEA-supplemented middle-aged men remained unaffected. When too much estrogen interacts with the estrogen receptors of the hypothalamus, there is a negative feed-back loop that tells the gland that there must be too much testosterone as well. By Posted on Mar 10, 2021. does hcg shut down hpta. Little Pink Pill AKA Female Viagra. But this combination only helps clean up the effects of the Estrogen Negative Feed-Back Loop leaving the Androgen Negative Feed-Back Loop unaffected. .hide-if-no-js { All patients had physical examination, BMI calculated and lab tests performed at 1 month and 3 months. The result of taking testosterone from outside the body is the suppression of 3 primary hormones in the HPTA. In addition, he worked with multiple MMA stars to get them ready for fights. with a goal of, possibly, using HCG as a sole TRT. The result is hormone withdrawal symptoms. one way to think of HPTA shut down is to think of it being 'binary' , like a 'switch' , its either off or on. Anastrolzole is a generic name for the drug Arimidex. These three components make up the HPTAxis. I'm not sure that length of time matters that much,, other then in regards to "shutdown' vs 'suppression'' . First lets start with HPTA. I know this is a rare situation. Before I go on, realize that this is the catalyst for all of the good things you really want to happen if performance optimization is your goalso take the time to read it! An HPTA restart will comprise of two phases, HCG and AI use to activate the testicles to be receptive to the LH/FSH pulse when the medications are discontinued.